Regeneration One Thread

[Lycantendencies]

Okay, so it's a while away, but I was super excited and wondered how everyone else was feeling about it.

And to make this thread a little less useless right now, Links for the cover and page on the off chance anyone missed them.

Cover (http://wildwords.wordpress.com/2011/12/22/transformers-regeneration-cover-art/) and Page (http://twitter.com/#!/chris_ryall/status/144168202379866112/photo/1).

[Death's Head]

given Furman's current form, i can't see this being up to much. i'm also baffled to think why anyone thought this was necessary or warranted. G2 effectively closed the Marvel continuity, so who desperately needed to have this revisited?

[Lycantendencies]

i'm also baffled to think why anyone thought this was necessary or warranted.
I can't speak for anyone else obviously, but for me there's a few reasons.

For a start IDW just keeping redoing G1 over and over again anyway, and if you're gonna do that surely it's better to just go back to the original, especially when the original did what it did so well for so long, and did it without going through the majority of the problems that have plagued IDW's ongoings.
Also, with keeping Rodimus as leader in the future and having Transformers evolve so far that Optimus Prime was half human and Unicron was over...finished, it was the one series that genuinely moved the franchise on, which gives some hope that we may get that again.
And whilst G2 had a couple of very well written moments and did wrap things up, it has dated terribly, and between it and the rushed ending G1 got in the first place it would be nice to see things handled perhaps more as they had wanted.

Mostly it's just that and there's just really nothing of worth fiction wise in the franchise and hasn't been since Animated finished. It'll be nice to see something with the name Transformers that actually makes me feel more than apathy.
Basically it fills the same role as Classics did for the toys.

Again, just speaking for myself.

[DeadCaL]

Enough people expressed an interest to warrant it. The only thing I'm slightly disappointed by is how closely they are sticking to the 80's aesthetics. It's a bit like what happened with Halo Anniversary, we were all hoping for Halo 1 in the newest, shiniest, most up to date game engine, and all we got was a lick of paint and a few nice textures.

[Lycantendencies]

The only thing I'm slightly disappointed by is how closely they are sticking to the 80's aesthetics.
I do understand that though. The Marvel series has a lot of die hard fans, some of which are concerned this could be typical newer IDW stuff with the old name tacked on, and IDW have a couple of continuities they created that they want to push seperately that are very much their own, so this sets it apart even at a glance.
Of course if the title is successful enough to maintain I'd imagine this would quickly change and we'd see the art quickly transition to something much more modern.

[Dreadwing]

Okay, so it's a while away, but I was super excited and wondered how everyone else was feeling about it.

And to make this thread a little less useless right now, Links for the cover and page on the off chance anyone missed them.

Cover (http://wildwords.wordpress.com/2011/12/22/transformers-regeneration-cover-art/) and Page (http://twitter.com/#!/chris_ryall/status/144168202379866112/photo/1).

I Agee with you but a little scared. There is always a risk when you deal with canon, though.

That frightens me.

[Death's Head]

I do understand that though. The Marvel series has a lot of die hard fans, some of which are concerned this could be typical newer IDW stuff with the old name tacked on, and IDW have a couple of continuities they created that they want to push seperately that are very much their own, so this sets it apart even at a glance.
Of course if the title is successful enough to maintain I'd imagine this would quickly change and we'd see the art quickly transition to something much more modern.

...and if they did that, surely that would undermine the point. This is very much a full on retro project, that Hasbro weren't keen on hence the finite number of issues dealt to Furman. So, given that the marvel US original comic ended in the throes of the Action Masters, are we going to see these characters return - ditto the Pretenders - or are we, as I suspect, just going to see the same old faces from '84 - '86..? And is Furman actaully capable now of recapturing that same vibe and feel of that time? The odds seem to me to be stacked to much against this book. Plus, I'd rather we weren't yet again living off past glories.

[Lycantendencies]

...and if they did that, surely that would undermine the point.
Nah, plenty of things have traded on nostalgia only to find favour with the audience and be evolved into something old yet modern. Capcom's Street Fighter and MVC3 are perfect examples of that imo.

Plus, I'd rather we weren't yet again living off past glories.
Almost all fictional franchises have this problem though.
Marvel didn't stop all their regular titles and replace them with Ultimates because fans would go beserk.
As radical and creative as some newer stuff is, they still live on past glories at the same time. They could never do it the way we've had it.
Same with the regular titles. They may have given Dick Grayson Batman's cowl, but before long Bruce Wayne took it back again.
By comparison, we've got it quite light for trading on the past.
Well, except that whole retelling the 1984 story every couple of years

And then again, maybe we wouldn't need to live on past glories if the current state of things wasn't so completely awful.

The movies are a creative vaccum and IDW show us just how much the lack of single vision forced by Hasbro can make a comic series a mess.
And TF Prime, well it was just dull, and in my opinion suffers for trying to be a bit of everything rather than being all of it's own thing.

Same with toys and games, where G1 based products, including third party products are almost drowning out anything based on newer stuff because it's all just so dull and uninspired.

I Agee with you but a little scared. There is always a risk when you deal with canon, though.

That frightens me.
It frightens me too. George Lucas has left me very, very cautious about these projects.

[Grimbo]

Personally speaking... I. Cannot. Wait. That said, I've already waited twenty years so a few more months won't hurt.

[red laser]

I missed the talks on Regeneration One at Roll Call Roll Out 3 is it supposed to ignore Generation 2 or be set before it?

[Death's Head]

It ignores it...sort of. Its a direct continuation of the original Marvel series...but moving things on 20 years for no good reason. If you're doing a retro book, you might as well pick it up from exactly where you left off, you'll be preaching to the converted with this thing anyway. Personally, if I were embarking on this, I'd have gone back to #80, what with #81 being a bit of a rushed conclusion. It's not something I personally felt was a necessary project to embark on.

As Generation 2 is one of the best Transformers comics out there, it's a shame that revisionism on the part of the publisher and author will make this an irrelevance now. Furman has reportedly said that he doesn't particularly care for Generation 2 and is actually embarrassed by it as being "too nineties", a pity given the high regard that comic is generally held in.

[Robtimus]

Generation 2 will become what G.I. Joe: Disavowed has become after G.I. Joe continued with 156. It still exists, but has been put into an alternate timeline / dimension / whatever.

[blainelee]

Generation 2 will become what G.I. Joe: Disavowed has become after G.I. Joe continued with 156.

Right

[red laser]

Mind you Generation 2 had the Marvel GI Joe in it so maybe that's why in some ways as well it is now ignored. Other than that the colouring was terrible at times.

[DeadCaL]

I saw a video review of it and realised how 90's and Judge Dredd it all was. Even the writing was TO THE MAXX!

[red laser]

Dredd wasn't fully bad and this is coming from a long time Dredd fan.

[DeadCaL]

Yeah, but it fitted in with the comic. The G2 comic was all spit, gritted teeth and robots covered in ammo belts.

[Death's Head]

...well they were at war...! plus, that was a dliberate choice on behalf of artist Derek Yaniger whom drew his inspiration from 2000AD's ABC Warriors (specifically Simon Bisley's run on 'The Black Hole'). I don't like the revisonism G2 is coming in for now, just because Simon Furman is embarrassed by one of the best TF comics he ever wrote. And I'll take Sara Mossof's inside-the-lines-using-the-correct-colours colouring over Nel Yomtov's crayola scrawls anyday. That the colouring doesn't look as amazing by today's standards is a symptom of where US comic colouring technology was at the time - it took them longer to catch up to painted / computer colouring than it did us Europeans. I'd also argue that the colouring used by Mossoff looks far better on the original newssprint stock than when reproduced on the glossier paper used for Titan's trades.

[The Goddamn Andy Turnbull]

I hold G2 in quite high regard and still do.

The new Regeneration 1 series doesn't invalidate it as such it still exists and I still enjoy it. To be honest the colouring still holds up pretty well, far too much colouring these days is photoshop porn. Ooh look what I can do, rather than service the story which should be it's prime consideration.

Andy

[red laser]

It wasn't colouring was poor compared to today's standards it was a case of Prime at one point was purple so was Hawk and other GI Joe characters so seriously the G2 colouring was horrendous!

[Grimbo]

Generation 2 will become what G.I. Joe: Disavowed has become after G.I. Joe continued with 156. It still exists, but has been put into an alternate timeline / dimension / whatever.

Yep, and there's plenty of alternatie timelines in the Marvel continuity anyway, so one more isn't a problem. Personally, #80.5 lived up to my expectations. I had a serious nostalgic blast reading it.

[red laser]

I got my 80.5 today it was good but I think should have got more pages and less ads in it. But I know IDW loves to have page upon page of ads in their comics. Looking back at #80 Bludgeon was in charge of the Decepticons and not Soundwave or does it continue on from the EarthForce stories which got confusing regarding continuity?

[DeadCaL]

I was expecting a bit more evolution in the art style. Oh well.

[Starscream]

OK, I admit, I'm hopelessly out of touch here - but where do I get one, and who do I need to kill to get it? Where is it up to, where is mine and why do I not have one?

[Robtimus]

http://www.oneshallstand.com/comics1.html

[Starscream]

http://www.oneshallstand.com/comics1.html

Wicked, ta. Ordered them :)

[Robtimus]

You're welcome :)

[DeadCaL]

Guido Guidi's on the credits. Is he doing internal art and not Andrew?

[The Goddamn Andy Turnbull]

Nope. He's doing variant covers.

So 81 is out now.

Have to say I loved it, and I do think it works as a comic in it's own right and not just as a nostalgia trip. Some interesting plot threads developing already and what a way to end the issue.

Andy

[DeadCaL]

I just read 81 and well, what a blast from the past. I called up a friend to see if he'd read it yet and he asked "Why, does Unicron turn up in the first issue or something?" :D

Almost bought the 100 page catchup thingy, but flicking through it I realised I remember most of it anyway.

[The Goddamn Andy Turnbull]

My love for these comics meant I'd preordered both versions of the 100 page spectacular - just to own the variant covers.

I need help.

Andy

[The Viz]

I didnt even know these had started. Just found out at the weekedn that Forbidden Planet had just decided to not put Regeneration One aside for me even thou im down for everything Transformers.

Do i really need to get the 80.5 issue or can i just jump in with 81? They can get 81 for me but not 80.5.

[dannyannimus]

80.5 was a free comic book day issue. I bought one on ebay this week, but it cost me £5. There were others available, if you decide to get one.

[DeadCaL]

It's not totally necessary, but I think 81 does refer to stuff from the previous one. Can't remember exactly. 80.5 was free, so check the other comic shops in town. I think my shop has some left.

[Death's Head]

I picked up a couple of Regeneration One issues. The 100 page spectacular isn't quite, being a reprint of the last four issues of the Marvel run which still bear all the hallmarks of a series rushing to cram an ending onto an abruptly cancelled comic and also #81. Whilst not out and out terrible, the book is in the unfortunate position of mimicing IDWs RID book, addresses few of the dangling plot threads from the closing Marvel issues and features two of my pet peeves : 1) bloody Unicron. Again. 2) Treating obscure Euro g1.5 and G2 characters as cannon fodder, as if a lifetime of obscurity isn't bad enough, these characters are the butt of every TF writers jokes. Or is it simply that these are the only characters Hasbro couldn't give a sh*t about and writers can get away with killing them off?

Also: Not keen on the 'Megatron On the Toilet' cover.

[Robtimus]

Who would you rather have killed - G1 characters just about everybody knows, or G1.5 / G2 characters that are a lot more obscure? I'm sometimes a bit annoyed when they kill off some characters (those two Technobots in Kimia for instance).

[Death's Head]

The death's of characters that are just given a line or two, a short scene or are just there always feel cheap. I'm sure Hasbro lays down the law about whom can and can't be killed off, but I am sick of seeing anyone whom isn't a big name bumped off. It never feels warranted or adds any drama.

I've read #82 of this....NOTHING IS HAPPENING!!!! At a time when IDWs other TF comics are busy and involving, this just isn't. Its not terrible, but its just not engaging. And what's with previously obliterated characters like Brainstorm showing up with nary a scratch? I know these are robots...but still, it does somewhat undermine the powerful stuff Furman did on the original US run. I'd like to know why Furman is keeping to decompressed storytelling at a time when comics are moving beyond the 'widescreen' format of storytelling where sod all happens each issue.

[Robtimus]

Perhaps Furman forgot he killed of Brainstorm. I must admit, I had to check the TF Archive Book of the Dead (http://tfarchive.com/community/showthread.php?t=16775) before I remembered he was eaten by Unicron, as his first victim during the attack on Cybertron.

[dannyannimus]

Myabe I'm being too optimistic, but Furman's always played the long game with his writing, seeding elements slowly. I've frequently said in the past that his storylines always read better as books, all in one go, than as comics. Although this is technically a continuation, the 21 years later part makes it virtually a new start anyway, with the original series acting more as a history, with little direct influence.
We'll see how far he's got an the end of the first story arc.

[fudgecrumpet]

Brainstorm showed up with nary a scratch because he had a new body built with his original head, as removed in Headmasters #1-4. Probably a quick way to refill the cast given the great Unicron kill-off.

[Death's Head]

Maybe I missed something, but I awlays thought that the Headmasters were engineered out of a combination of the Nebulans bodies and the heads of the various Transformers... or was I asleep for that sequence in the old Marvel comics..?

[dannyannimus]

Maybe you're right, but I think their old heads were taken off, then replaced with identical ones that also served as Nebulan body armour. So basically, their old heads were just sat in a cupboard for 20 years, and have now been fitted to new bodies. This raises a few questions. 1. Why didn't they just adapt the original heads to house the Nebulans. 2. If they can fit the old heads to new bodies and maintain the personalities, does that mean that the heads were all conscious in their cupboard? I'm sure initially, the personality was supposed to download into the body, but if that happened, then the old heads are useless.

[DeadCaL]

If you've seen Red Dwarf. The heads in a cupboard thing should be quite funny :-D

[Death's Head]

Maybe you're right, but I think their old heads were taken off, then replaced with identical ones that also served as Nebulan body armour. So basically, their old heads were just sat in a cupboard for 20 years, and have now been fitted to new bodies. This raises a few questions. 1. Why didn't they just adapt the original heads to house the Nebulans. 2. If they can fit the old heads to new bodies and maintain the personalities, does that mean that the heads were all conscious in their cupboard? I'm sure initially, the personality was supposed to download into the body, but if that happened, then the old heads are useless.

Nope. You are right. Just dug out 'Trial By Fire'. I'm clearly confusing the cartoon with the comics. In a rare, inversion of normal policy, this is one point that the Cartoon makes sense on. In the Marvel Comics, the process is thus:

"Joints are replaced...armour plates are attached... until what had been [the Nebulans] now look like the heads of [the Autobots]"

and

"Although no longer commanders of their own bodies' fates, the original heads of the Autobot bodies maintain radio contact with their ... Nebulan successors"

Which raises quite a lot of questions about things that I hadn't thought of before. Mostly, if the Nebulans are now in control of the Autobots bodies, how on Earth do you get problems like with Gort/ Highbrow and Spike / Fort Max whereby the two personalities are actively clashing with each other? Surely that wouldn't happen once the Headmaster is out of range of the original Autobot head! It does however, explain the monologuing of Lord Zarak when he compares himself to "the original Scorponok".

I always thought that the original heads were used to make that fancy armour for the Nebulans to allow them to Transform, and there was an initial separation of the two personalities that in some instances either merged with the Autobot/ Decepticon personality, or one became more dominant than the other (Zarak/ Scorponok). i guess I'd just done a Beast Wars and merged the two continuities together in my head.

Even so, now I've had that little revelation, how silly is it leaving a bunch of heads lying about on Nebulos - and how would the embargo on Cybertronian life have affected them? Indeed, given that all Transformer life wasn't welcome or wanted on Nebulos, why are the Nebulans suddenly building new bodies for them?


I think I'm actually quite disappointed with Marvel's take on the Headmaster process now.

[dannyannimus]

Issue 83 today, and we're getting somewhere. I won't spoil it, but all the initial exposition to set up the new status quo finally gives way to a bit story progression. Could this be the return to form from Furman we've been waiting for?

[Death's Head]

Ohh Sspoil away Danny, I'd like to know what happens, but don't think this'll be one I'm stick with. There's better comics out there to blow £3.00 on. Or i could put it towards a pint...

[dannyannimus]

Oh, what the hell. Circuit Smasher isn't the son of Circuit Breaker, as seemed the most obvious explanation, but is actually Spike, repaired by Blackrock using a combination of the Circuit Smasher technology and the Headmaster tech already in his body. Some unknown person went into the Ark and resurrected Megatron, who, for once, got himself organised before using the Ark technology to override the command codes of all of Earth's nuclear missiles, thus destroying the major cities and military bases. Fortress Maximus was the only remaining TF, due to being bonded to Spike, so he and Blackrock's crew were the only remaining resistance. They're still around, but have essentially failed.
Meanwhile, Optimus has received the distress call from the Wreckers, so has set off for Earth, guilty about abandoning it. He has left Rodimus, (or Hot Rod, whichever) in charge on Cybertron, which has caused Bludgeon, in a cliffhanger ending, to declare that he is going after the remains of Thunderwing.

[Death's Head]

On paper, that sounds quite good...but i've a feeling it wont quite live up to expectations if i read it. I think i've still got this on my SO at OK, so i'll check it out and see what i think.

[Death's Head]

I didn't end up buying this when I went to my comic shop yesterday. I had a leaf through it and wasn't terribly impressed. I just feel this book really is raking over the past and that's not a good thing. It's a bit like 'ooh remember that bit, well...' rather than developing the scope of the original Marvel book as # 76 - 80 were starting to do.

The guy that ran the shop looked a little surprised :
Jared "Really? But this was supposed to be the Second Coming of Jesus as far as Transformers is concerned."
Me: "But its just not very good. The James Roberts book I get is the best one."
Jared : "But all the Transformers fans say this is the one. It outsells the other two books 2:1 here. So you're swimming against the tide of your brethern's opinion?"
Me : "Most Transformers fans don't seem to be able to recognise terrible comics, though."
Jared: "Ah well, I have to be honest, all these books look the same to me. Its just metal men hitting each other"

And therein lies the truth of perhaps why IDW are not reaching a wider audience with these comics...

[Death's Head]

Regeneration # 84 made its way into my SO, although I didn't notice till I got home. A much improved issue, with a lot more pace too it, although Circuit Smasher is deeply embarrasing and Furman should be ashamed of himself. Couldn't they have just had the Neo Knights just be dead or something? Anyway, with dull predictability, Starscream whom Megatron hadn't rendered totally zombified manages to recapture some autonomy. This is why I don't like Starscream. He's always used in situations like this to screw Megatron over. Aside from that, the rest of the issue was pretty good. Wildman doesn't really seem to have his heart in this though. Although improved, his art is still a bit 'wonky' looking (Roadbuster's head keeps changing size and shape) and there is a real lack of backgrounds too, which always bothers me.

[dannyannimus]

#85 this week. A fairly decent, although kind of predictable end to the first arc, which leads into a promising second arc, which diverges from what we've seen for the past 10 years of TF comics.

[jackabina]

Just got into these after having a chat with Simon Furham at NORCON in september. What a nice chap he is.

[Robtimus]

I hated when Springer got killed :( Other than that nothing really stood out to me. Optimus finally had the balls to finish Megatron, although it was Kup that did the most work in the end. I just hope that Galvatron won't be Megatron part 2.

[DeadCaL]

Just got into these after having a chat with Simon Furham at NORCON in september. What a nice chap he is.

Yeah, I tried to take a picture of him at AA and he jumped up and suggested we take a photo together. I had to grab someone and get them to take it. Attention whore ;-)

[Death's Head]

A fairly average issue, and I'm still not totally sold on the 20 years into the future thing. It would have also been nice if IDW have given the book the same 'retro' colouring work over given to the flashback scenes in the MTMTE & RID Annuals. Wildman's back ground deficient artwork is also starting to bug me now.

[jackabina]

Yeah, I tried to take a picture of him at AA and he jumped up and suggested we take a photo together. I had to grab someone and get them to take it. Attention whore ;-)
Ha, I should maybe have tapped himup for a pick. I felt quite sorry for him really, everyone was flocking around Jeremy Bullock.

[Death's Head]

So I am still reading this. Its not come off my standing order just yet. I must have been asleep though, As I have clearly missed Scorponok's ressurection. Something that, frankly, I could have lived without and also undoes one of the most powerful scenes in any TF comic. Wildman's art is noticably much nicer this issue, although the lack of backgrounds is really really really annoying.

[dannyannimus]

The resrrection is explained.

[Robtimus]

Basically, all of the Headmasters are still alive. Their bodies and Nebulon partners may have been destroyed but the original heads, apparently unconscious but still alive, remained on Nebulos.

[fudgecrumpet]

Which is all kind of necessary because there's a distinct lack of decent characters left following Marvel's Unicron kill-fest.

[DeadCaL]

Ah, I've missed convoluted plot twists and things that get resolved instantly.
"Me Grimlock resisting as hard as Grimlock can..."
"OK, Bored now. Me give in"

[Robtimus]

Basically, all of the Headmasters are still alive. Their bodies and Nebulon partners may have been destroyed but the original heads, apparently unconscious but still alive, remained on Nebulos.
I just thought of something. Simon Furman just went to all this "trouble" to change Spike after Fort Max died, but he didn't really die if Scorponok and Brainstorm are still alive, did he? Because he wasn't any different from them.

[dannyannimus]

Not sure without checking (and I can't be bothered), but maybe because he was the human part, not the TF part, and because he did stuff other than be a headmaster, he survived. The Nebulans seemed to headmasters more full time.

[Robtimus]

I was talking about Fort Max, not Spike. His head is still on Nebulos and should be just as much alive as Brainstorm.

[dannyannimus]

Oh yeah, good point.

[Death's Head]

I picked up #86 and I have read it, and my overall impression is just one of 'uhhhh'. I'm going to have to take this off my standing order. It's just not doing anything for me. I can't believe anyone thought this was worth it for a few minor plot points left over from the old Marvel book. Did anyone really care about the heads left on Nebulos? No. I'm not sure about this whole evil Autobots thing, and Furman's trying to be clever CNA thing. He's definitely a nature over nuture guy, clearly. This whole thing passes me by everytime I read it and seem to not be grasping all the stuff that is apparently going on in this book when I read about it online. It just seems so empty to me. Baskerville continues to hide a multitude of sins for Wildman, whom is still background deficient. I don't honestly feel that he has much interest in this book.

...money for old rope. but not old rope that you'd actually want or could find a use for.